The New York Times reports that on Friday rebels in northern Mali declared an independent state of Azawad. While the National Movement for the Liberation of Azawad maintains an English version of their website, it is not up-to-date. However, the group posted their declaration of independence on the French version of the site, declaring "irrevocably the independent state of Azawad, starting from this day, Friday April 6, 2012." Of course, there is a Wikipedia page devoted to Azawad which includes a flag and map of the fledgling state. As of this writing, no other independent country has yet recognized the independence of Azawad.
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Comments
Recall just a year ago all the happy comments made here about the new country of South Sudan? Actually there was nothing happy to report neither then nor now. In fighting with their countrymen (Sudanese) South Sudanese had lost far more in battlefield deaths in a few years than the US has lost in all its wars from 1776.
South Sudan has almost no roads, hospitals nor doctors. They have about 150 miles of single track narrow gauge railroad. Access to no port. The mortality rate for children and maternity deaths are off-the-chart. With an average IQ of about 70 where could you find those educable? The number of people in South Sudan is estimated at 8 million but there has not been a real census for decades.
But South Sudan has a flag. According to the article so does Azawad so I guess they will be OK too?
Hi, I wanted to note that the UN recognizes a state just after the entire international community accepts the independence of it. Azawad for now is an attempt at separation of Mali, without official recognition. The countries recognized by the UN are now 193, to which is added the Vatican State as special status. Very good report and the update of the Political Geography of the world. Greetings.
Don Hirschberg, I am quite disappointed with your comments. I am a South Sudanese and I found your comments degrading and insulting. Before you mak such negative comments, please do your research first.
Somehow, some of your comments might be correct. But they are correct because of the cruel oppression the Arab rulers had exerted on the peoples of South Sudan. For example, South Sudanese people were not allowed to study past grade four. Now tell me where in the world would you find a government that does not allow its citizens to study past grade four if they can and want to. Only in the Sudan.
Unfortunately, your comment on the IQ is insulting. When did you take an IQ test of the people of South Sudan? To give you an idea about the IQ comment, it happened during the war that few South Sudanese had opportunities to go abroad to study. Now we have in South Sudan PhDs holders in economics, engineering, maths and medicines. Now what does that tell you. It tells you that if these people were given chances to have education, your average IQ would have been much higher than that.
More importantly, South Sudan didn’t declare a unilateral independence. It was done democratically through referendum which was monitored by international community and observers. Interestingly, the first country to recognise the results and independence of the South Sudan was the Republic of Sudan. Now tell me, what democratic ways did Azawad follow? Absolutely none! Who will then recognise the state of Azawad? Absolutely no one! So shut up and leave the people of South Sudan alone!!!
Don Hirschberg, I am quite disappointed with your comments. I am a South Sudanese and I found your comments degrading and insulting. Before you mak such negative comments, please do your research first.
Somehow, some of your comments might be correct. But they are correct because of the cruel oppression the Arab rulers had exerted on the peoples of South Sudan. For example, South Sudanese people were not allowed to study past grade four. Now tell me where in the world would you find a government that does not allow its citizens to study past grade four if they can and want to. Only in the Sudan.
Unfortunately, your comment on the IQ is insulting. When did you take an IQ test of the people of South Sudan? To give you an idea about the IQ comment, it happened during the war that few South Sudanese had opportunities to go abroad to study. Now we have in South Sudan PhDs holders in economics, engineering, maths and medicines. Now what does that tell you. It tells you that if these people were given chances to have education, your average IQ would have been much higher than that.
More importantly, South Sudan didn’t declare a unilateral independence. It was done democratically through referendum which was monitored by international community and observers. Interestingly, the first country to recognise the results and independence of the South Sudan was the Republic of Sudan. Now tell me, what democratic ways did Azawad follow? Absolutely none! Who will then recognise the state of Azawad? Absolutely no one! So shut up and leave the people of South Sudan alone!!!
Hey Matt,
Does that mean that you are adding this “new” country to your list of nations? Because at the local Starbucks here, I have to name the countries in alphabetical order when there is a new barista; otherwise I don’t get my drink until I do!
Joseph Mapuor : Now tell me, what democratic ways did Azawad follow? Absolutely none!”
These democratic ways in South Sudan happened only after many years of civil war. Maybe it will take a few years of civil war for Azawad to get to a democratic way.
Thanks Ken. Maybe, Azawad rebels will one day realise that the only way to be recognise internationally is through dialogue.
Having said that, I am not against the will of the people of Azawad quest for independence. I am against someone who unintelligently insults the people of the South Sudan who had suffered so much for so long in the hands of the Arab oppressors.
Lastly, what are the reasons for the Azawad rebels quest for independence? I don’t see any fundamental reasons for the separation except hunger for power.
Joseph Mapuor wrote,” Don Hirschberg, I am quite disappointed with your comments.”
No, Joseph, actually you are disappointed with the facts not my comments. I am only the messenger. I’m sure you know the old saying, if you don’t like the message shoot the messenger.
I believe everything in my comments came from a respected source on the internet. Tell me where I am wrong. Facts are stubborn things. And if I were a South Sudanese I’d be quite disappointed too. (Good grief didn’t I read that health care might be the worst in the all the 190 or so countries of the world!)
Last year when we read gushing comments about South Sudan’s impending independence I pointed out, for example, that without an agreement with Sudan as to how to handle the oil production I didn’t see how the new nation could be viable. Today the oil situation is absolutely chaotic without a good solution imaginable. What else can replace oil income for South Sudan?
I see that renewed military action is now going on with Sudan, an air force bombing just yesterday. Do you see any improvement in the religious differences? I am sad about the dire situation but can find no basis for optimism.
im proudly for tuareg movement,
WHY PEOPLE THEY ARE COMPLAIN FOR THAT SITUATION?
Wow! How cool is it that you have South Sudanese and Taureg people posting on your site! Some of the most interesting information I hear is from cab drivers or street vendors or hotel workers or my students – all of whom are from places all over the world – and are always willing to share their opinions with a Geography teacher. We just had a tour of Belfast with a cab driver who certainly gave us the inside story from the Catholic perspective. Fascinating!
Great stuff, Matt!
Marcia says, “Some of the most interesting information I hear is from cab drivers or street vendors or hotel workers or my students…” I’ll readily grant “most interesting” but how about most factual? The truth? On the other hand would you put much value on what a cab driver in D.C. or NY, or Chicago says? Why not?
But then few of us have much contact with foreign cab drivers or hotel workers unless we are working for the government or part of a tax financed social program. Perhaps as a teacher?
Dear Joseph, I was upset by the comments posted here, simply an ad hominem attack on a culture which the author lacks any experience or direct knowledge. I not Sudanese but I come in contact with dogmatic personalities frequently who offer facts to support their own beliefs, committing confirmation bias. Stating South Sudanese make war on their “own countrymen” is absurd. The Arabs of the former country of Sudan have practiced nothing but systematic government sponsored terrorism against native populations for decades. That is fact no one can deny. The Janjaweed are government sponsored terrorists – indisputable fact. Poor health care? Sure, a fact, but the reality is the national government of Khartoum created that situation by preventing any development in southern Sudan, except for the oil fields. As for the IQ statement, to my knowledge no substantive study has ever been produced examining only South Sudanese. In fact, no study period. IQ exams are notoriously wrong and measure nothing. Even if one were produced, IQ exams do exhibit a Western-bias. In other words, non-Western cultures tend not to perform well on them. When people raise the issue of IQ flags go up for me as this hyperbole is evident among racists and white supremecists in the US.
In closing, do not get too upset over comments. Unfortunately, there are lots of ignorant people in the world, and everyone is entitled to their opinion, which means a lot of ignorant opinions run rampant.